Chris's Podcast #1: Nintendo Should Just Quit

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Alrighty then... This launches my first podcast entry into the bank of Armchair Arcade podcasts - My first topic focuses on Nintendo. I do not really rant on this as it might seem, however I do inject an opinion that most certainly will not be shared by all.

It is unedited. There are typical pauses, clearing of the throat, etc as I gather my thoughts. Although I personally prefer to edit a podcast and try to strive for high production values, there is something to be said about purely focusing on the fun aspect of it all.

I hope you guys enjoy it.

Download the m4a.

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Rob Daviau
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He HE

FLAC I get it! I Knew that lol! of course I am actually converting it into MP3 using BONK audio encoder. I don't really care I was just messing with you!

But to be truthful I do not use iTunes, will not buy an APPLE product (outside of a classic APPLE computer maybe someday for collection purposes) and I refuse to install iTunes. My request for MP3 is purely selfish as I say I like to walk around listening to you guys on my GP2X Caanoo handheld.

For the record I have nothing against APPLE really, I am into all tech but I am proud that I have resisted all modern APPLE products lol.

n/a
Bill Loguidice
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GP
Rob Daviau wrote:

... to be truthful I do not use iTunes, will not buy an APPLE product (outside of a classic APPLE computer maybe someday for collection purposes) and I refuse to install iTunes. My request for MP3 is purely selfish as I say I like to walk around listening to you guys on my GP2X Caanoo handheld.

There's a rumor that GamePark Holdings is going to declare bankruptcy any time now. Too bad, but not surprising considering the costs and competition involved.

n/a
clok1966
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to bad
Bill Loguidice wrote:
Rob Daviau wrote:

... to be truthful I do not use iTunes, will not buy an APPLE product (outside of a classic APPLE computer maybe someday for collection purposes) and I refuse to install iTunes. My request for MP3 is purely selfish as I say I like to walk around listening to you guys on my GP2X Caanoo handheld.

There's a rumor that GamePark Holdings is going to declare bankruptcy any time now. Too bad, but not surprising considering the costs and competition involved.

I so want to comment on Robs.. but I'm leaving that dog alone. As for gamepark.. I really loved my Old GP2X, the thumbstick mod made it a pretty sweet machine (for its time) not counting battery life. But I must admit I was shocked it had the following it did. YOu gotta admit it was pretty much made to use products (roms) that 99.99999999% of us cant dump legally. So it legally its uses where very limited for the average user depending on your views of all that. Thye seemed to pioneer that segment of handhelds and deserved lots of praise, but once again Phones are killing that market too. I can see them dying, the 'standard" price point put them pretty much borderline out of reach and the namebrand guys (nintendo, sony) all had hacked machines that did basicly the same thing in the last few years.. and now.. a phone and all the fun too.. cant really beat that, ONE thing to carry You simply cant underestimate what tha means. Its sad if they do go out, but looking long terem i cant see a reason to own one nowdays (well a newer product).

Rob Daviau
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Oh well
Bill Loguidice wrote:

There's a rumor that GamePark Holdings is going to declare bankruptcy any time now. Too bad, but not surprising considering the costs and competition involved.

Too bad. Don't see it being any issue for me, I have my Caanoo and am damn happy with it, though it would be sad seeing a company that makes an open source handheld go down. Anyway, it serves it's purpose for me well, with the great emulators I have not touched my PSP or DS in ages and will likely sell or trade them at some point.

@clok1966
Well I am in the group that has no issue moral or otherwise using roms, especially for outdated (but still fun) consoles like Colecovision or computers like the AtariST so yeah it is a great system for emulators, handheld MAME on the go! I am well aware of the cracks, hacked firmwares and the like for PSP and DS etc but the thing with those is the constant up keep required staying one step ahead everytime an update defeated the hack you had to redo it all with the latest fix over and over. I much preferred having a handheld that was open sourced and designed to encourage emulation, ports and development.

n/a
clok1966
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to bad
Rob Daviau wrote:

@clok1966
Well I am in the group that has no issue moral or otherwise using roms, especially for outdated (but still fun) consoles like Colecovision or computers like the AtariST so yeah it is a great system for emulators, handheld MAME on the go! I am well aware of the cracks, hacked firmwares and the like for PSP and DS etc but the thing with those is the constant up keep required staying one step ahead everytime an update defeated the hack you had to redo it all with the latest fix over and over. I much preferred having a handheld that was open sourced and designed to encourage emulation, ports and development.

You and me both :) I still prefer my Gp to my PSP and others.. But those others (psps, GBA, etc.. ) just have to big a user base. I will be sad to see an innovator go (if they do).

clok1966
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I could go with a single

I could go with a single console if I new I wouldnt get raked over the coals. MS has proven over and over when it has monoply it will RAPE you on price. I'm sure Sony would do the same (look at Bravia TV prices when they where considerd top of the line). Sadly i thinkj you hit the nail on the head with the political statment (rep/dem). We are in a rock and a hard place, and if you look at the user base its as heated as political battle.

I'm really hoping they can learn from this round.. Price (Wii was the sweet spot at $250) they all have reached it now ( 5 years later).. but this $400+ stuff needs to stop. This last round showed some big improvments, but I cant see how they can go much farther with the hardware. On the PC side we have much fancier displays and argubly more power, but consoles are limited to: HDTV graphics, graphics wise getting 60 FPS is about all the need, skip some of this upscaling/lying BS they do now, make it REALLY HD, not some twisted wanna be thing). otherwise they have it down graphicly. gamepads.. really limit game, if they would allow mice/keyboards I would be online on LIVE showing off my ability to curse too. But this GAMEPAD only mentality is not only wrong, its holding us PC centric guys from latching onto a robbust online gaming comunity and new games. I would gladly pay $50 (probebly a $100 if i could use it on games) or so for a mouse keyboard for my 360 with a MS brand name on it. Ican see why they are stretching this set out.. where can they go? The gadgets.. but one thing they have proved is.. $100+ gadget with no good games .. is worthless.. I see all the cool things they can do and hten see lackluster attmpts to make a game we all saw work with them.

I'm all for a standard console... but cant see it happening ever. As for nintendo packing it in.. didnt they just win this round of the console wars? If Sony and MS dont make a new console for 5 more years they still wont catch it. And Nintendo has made far more money on Hardware per unit then MS and sony ever have. Sell through of software.. MS is king, but per unit sony has done the best the last 2 years (one reason you dont see so many exclusives anymore).

Rowdy Rob
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Enjoyed it... the new "short show with solo host" is a good idea

I'm quite enjoying this new "solo host" podcast format. I haven't yet listened to Matt's second solo episode, but of course enjoyed the first one he did!

To bring up Chris' subject of "offending the fanboys," I'm not sure that any of you guys should be really concerned about it too much. After all, is any "serious" mature gamer really a fanboy? How could you be; you'd have to deny the great accomplishments that happen on "enemy camp" platforms or software developers. It's all games, so it's all good. (Except when it's bad.)

I think you handle "controversy" pretty well, Chris; you're opinionated, but not arrogant, insulting, and/or annoying. Intelligent, respectfully-delivered opinions are enjoyable to listen to.

On other subjects covered in the show:

the 3DS: I, too, was underwhelmed by the 3D effect. It adds surprisingly little to the gameplay. The screen is unfortunately too small to really get immersed in the 3D effect, and the very unforgiving viewing angle makes the 3D more of a hindrance than a positive experience. I was so looking forward to enjoying the 3D, only to come away severely disappointed. It certainly isn't a system seller once it's actually seen.

On the Wii-U: Again, Nintendo goes off in an "innovative" (i.e. oddball) direction. For the first Wii, the new motion controllers were not only attention-getting, they actually brought something logical to the table (making games more accessible to "noobs" who can't handle modern 400-button joypad controllers). The new Wii-U "video-screen" controllers seems like a mis-step to me, seeming to be more gimmick than innovation.

Which brings me to the main point of Chris' argument: software for Nintendo consoles, particularly third-party software, tends to be weak. I think it's because Nintendo hardware is lately so "oddball" in comparison to other "standard" consoles, so you have to be dedicated enough to the eccentricities of the Nintendo hardware to develop properly for it.

With the 360, PS3, and PC development, it's apparently easy to develop cross-platform titles that can be released on all three platforms, minimizing the financial risk for 3rd party developers. But with Nintendo, with its oddball controllers and dual-screens and such, you're going to have a hard time adapting your game to this platform! And if you don't take advantage of the "odd" Nintendo stuff, gamers will be disappointed.

I predict the Wii-U will meet a similar fate as the 3DS did... it will sell okay (at first), but gamers will not find the "screen" controllers particularly fun. How do you watch two screens while playing a game anyway? And 3rd-party developers will be just as befuddled trying to develop "two-screen" games for the system. So, once again, good first-party, but weak third-party games. I don't think the "screen" controllers will be system sellers like the Wii motion controls will, so I predict much softer sales for the Wii-U than the Wii.

Anyhow, just some of my thoughts...

About the new format:

How about a standardized "Armchair Arcade" musical intro like the old show had? That's basically all I would suggest (for now).

msimplay
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Joined: 10/07/2010
Hmm so I listened to your

Hmm so I listened to your podcast on Nintendo should quit and the comparison to Sega.
There is one flaw in your argument though your views are as per a gamer and Nintendo is a Business.
Which means as long as they are making money they will continue to do so in the way they know how DS and Nintendo Wii last generation were and are the most successful consoles this generation Sega was a dying a business due to their business decisions hence they had to become a software only company.
You argued that Nintendo should quit trying to find new ideas such as 3d for their hand held but this flies in the face of innovation.
Currently anything that Nintendo has come up with as innovators others have copied and it makes me wonder if Nintendo became a 3rd party only would the industry become stagnant with the same old cycles in hardware upgrades.
Nintendo has changed the way the whole industry regards a console life cycle especially this generation Nintendo stuck to the classic 5 year cycle and having done so by using technically inferior hardware to the current gen consoles which are now enjoying a 10 year life cycle with motion sensing peripherals.
I can understand however your views come from a personal stand because you have moved onto the other consoles point but I doubt that Nintendo becoming a 3rd party developer would be good for the industry as a whole.
My personal stance on the situation is that things are looking up as primary reasons for lack of 3rd party was the hardware last gen it didn't really affect the DS although the hardcore gamers seemed to be quite annoyed at this.
However it did have a great impact on the Wii since it wasn't in the glorious HD that everyone loves so much.
Either way for me the Wii has some great games excluding all the shovelware games like Wii Sports I have 17 games that I really do like to play such as Muramasa and Xenoblade and some more on my wishlist such as Donkey Kong Country Returns , Kirby and some unreleased Such as Skyward Sword with a great many I play on the virtual console.
The virtual console alone being worth the price of admission for myself simply because I can pack the older consoles away as I can play most classics on the Wii without having multiple classic consoles taking up space in my room.
Also With regards to 3rd party support things seem to be looking up the 3DS seems to have fantastic 3rd party support and the Wii U seems to be hot on it's heels.

The bottom line here is that as long as a company is profitable they will never become 3rd party Sega did because they lost too much money.

Chris Kennedy
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Thoughts

Thanks for your feedback, Rob. The solo, relaxed podcast format seems to have alleviated some of the problems I had with the flagship podcast - the main one being that it felt a lot like work! Whenever something that is fun begins to feel like more work, then is it truly worth it? There has to be a balance between work and fun.

msimplay wrote:

Hmm so I listened to your podcast on Nintendo should quit and the comparison to Sega.
There is one flaw in your argument though your views are as per a gamer and Nintendo is a Business.
Which means as long as they are making money they will continue to do so in the way they know how DS and Nintendo Wii last generation were and are the most successful consoles this generation Sega was a dying a business due to their business decisions hence they had to become a software only company.

After releasing the podcast, I wondered if I came off as saying that Nintendo was headed down the tubes like Sega. I was mostly gathering how I have felt about Nintendo 3rd party support over the years and expressing it as a bit of an annoyance with Nintendo.

That being said, Nintendo could certainly be headed down the same road as Sega if they aren't successful with the Wii U. I would like to think that I was mostly thinking as a business in addition to a gamer when I made the podcast - the two do go hand in hand. If Nintendo (or anyone else!) releases hardware that other companies don't want to support, then that is a failure. It doesn't really matter if Nintendo is selling decent 1st party games if people are adopting other systems. With the Wii - they had a hit. That system sold like hotcakes. The 3rd party software was there, but it would seem to me to be the "third choice" when it came to choosing it over the other systems. I view it like this - The Wii saved them from the Gamecube, and the Nintendo DS experiment turned into a rock on which they built themselves.

Nintendo likes being different - there is a large amount of risk-reward when it comes to their style. The industry seems to be changing in my eyes. Even Nintendo (Satoru Iwata) said they consider Apple to be their competitor. What that means to me is that Nintendo needs to out-Apple Apple. Nintendo has distanced themselves from the hardcore gaming systems for over a decade now, and they need to pull all the stops in order to stay competitive.

So again, I say "quit." Don't put your eggs in the hardware basket - put your I.P. on other platforms and reap the benefits there.

Quote:

You argued that Nintendo should quit trying to find new ideas such as 3d for their hand held but this flies in the face of innovation.
Currently anything that Nintendo has come up with as innovators others have copied and it makes me wonder if Nintendo became a 3rd party only would the industry become stagnant with the same old cycles in hardware upgrades.
Nintendo has changed the way the whole industry regards a console life cycle especially this generation Nintendo stuck to the classic 5 year cycle and having done so by using technically inferior hardware to the current gen consoles which are now enjoying a 10 year life cycle with motion sensing peripherals.

There is nothing wrong with being innovative - Nintendo certainly hit it with the dual screens on the DS and the motion controlling aspect of the Wii, but the 3DS is innovation failure. I own the thing and find myself saying, "who cares?" It is basically a DS with shorter battery life and a fancier operating system. Nintendo knows it is a failure - they had to drop the price due to poor sales. Now they are releasing peripherals ...for a handheld! It reminds me of...well...Sega! when they started turning the Genesis/Megadrive into a science experiment with the CD and 32x attachments.

Again - Quit, Nintendo! Even if you don't drop out of the hardware industry, it is time to start thinking about your next handheld's release date.

Quote:

I can understand however your views come from a personal stand because you have moved onto the other consoles point but I doubt that Nintendo becoming a 3rd party developer would be good for the industry as a whole.
My personal stance on the situation is that things are looking up as primary reasons for lack of 3rd party was the hardware last gen it didn't really affect the DS although the hardcore gamers seemed to be quite annoyed at this.

Hmm. I actually thought the DS had great 3rd party support! It is the Wii where I felt there was a lack of decent 3rd party titles.

You have a great example of a gimmick vs great innovation. The touch screen/dual screen aspect of the DS was something 3rd party developers got and latched onto. The Wii, on the other hand, felt like a gimmick and a tech demo.

Quote:

However it did have a great impact on the Wii since it wasn't in the glorious HD that everyone loves so much.
Either way for me the Wii has some great games excluding all the shovelware games like Wii Sports

I do not consider Wii Sports shovelware. I consider it the best game on the system - It was solely responsible for turning the Wii into a "must have" device.

Quote:

I have 17 games that I really do like to play such as Muramasa and Xenoblade and some more on my wishlist such as Donkey Kong Country Returns , Kirby and some unreleased Such as Skyward Sword with a great many I play on the virtual console.
The virtual console alone being worth the price of admission for myself simply because I can pack the older consoles away as I can play most classics on the Wii without having multiple classic consoles taking up space in my room.
Also With regards to 3rd party support things seem to be looking up the 3DS seems to have fantastic 3rd party support and the Wii U seems to be hot on it's heels.

The bottom line here is that as long as a company is profitable they will never become 3rd party Sega did because they lost too much money.

Sega made some BIG mistakes. I hope Nintendo doesn't make the same ones, but they need another hit if they stick with this game.

You say that the 3DS has fantastic 3rd party support. Are you aware of some games that have sold really well for the 3DS? Most everything I see promoted as a must have is a first party title. Same for the Wii U - Is there evidence that the Wii U is hot on the heels of the 3DS? Your statement ties into the "fantastic 3rd party support" of the 3DS, but I worry about the fate of the Wii U when someone says it is "hot on the heels of the 3DS."

Whatever Nintendo does - I wish them the best.

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msimplay
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Nintendo should stay IMO
Chris Kennedy wrote:

After releasing the podcast, I wondered if I came off as saying that Nintendo was headed down the tubes like Sega. I was mostly gathering how I have felt about Nintendo 3rd party support over the years and expressing it as a bit of an annoyance with Nintendo.

That being said, Nintendo could certainly be headed down the same road as Sega if they aren't successful with the Wii U. I would like to think that I was mostly thinking as a business in addition to a gamer when I made the podcast - the two do go hand in hand. If Nintendo (or anyone else!) releases hardware that other companies don't want to support, then that is a failure. It doesn't really matter if Nintendo is selling decent 1st party games if people are adopting other systems. With the Wii - they had a hit. That system sold like hotcakes. The 3rd party software was there, but it would seem to me to be the "third choice" when it came to choosing it over the other systems. I view it like this - The Wii saved them from the Gamecube, and the Nintendo DS experiment turned into a rock on which they built themselves.

Nintendo likes being different - there is a large amount of risk-reward when it comes to their style. The industry seems to be changing in my eyes. Even Nintendo (Satoru Iwata) said they consider Apple to be their competitor. What that means to me is that Nintendo needs to out-Apple Apple. Nintendo has distanced themselves from the hardcore gaming systems for over a decade now, and they need to pull all the stops in order to stay competitive.

So again, I say "quit." Don't put your eggs in the hardware basket - put your I.P. on other platforms and reap the benefits there.

I generally disagree simply because so far Nintendo has always been successful making more money on hardware sales coupled with their own software sales.
To be honest while the gamer needs 3rd party support for different games etc as a Business as long as my products sold I really wouldn't care too much.

Nintendo controls the hardware and software which is a benefit in itself

You base a lot on "if" ie if the Wii U does not do well which we don't even know yet as we didn't know when the Wii first came out
I prefer to base on facts instead of conjecture fact is that Wii is the most successful console this generation.
Personally to me the Wii U looks like a very interesting peice of kit I see the immediate benefits of the touchscreen much easier than the Wii mote when it was released.

I also disagree on statement about the Gamecube Nintendo still made the most money that generation also since they had their own following and the 3rd party support wasn't too bad in all honesty.
While gamers may see their consoles as failures due to not having xyz titles Nintendo have always been making money which is the bottom line why change something that works ?

Asking Nintendo to develop for other platforms at this time is like asking Microsoft to make games for Sony all are making money no company will sacrifice that no matter what happens.

Chris Kennedy wrote:

There is nothing wrong with being innovative - Nintendo certainly hit it with the dual screens on the DS and the motion controlling aspect of the Wii, but the 3DS is innovation failure. I own the thing and find myself saying, "who cares?" It is basically a DS with shorter battery life and a fancier operating system. Nintendo knows it is a failure - they had to drop the price due to poor sales. Now they are releasing peripherals ...for a handheld! It reminds me of...well...Sega! when they started turning the Genesis/Megadrive into a science experiment with the CD and 32x attachments.

Again - Quit, Nintendo! Even if you don't drop out of the hardware industry, it is time to start thinking about your next handheld's release date.

Well it depends how you view a console again you equate Nintendo to Sega however Nintendo is still in the running and Sega is not since Nintendo did not and has not released the experiment of attachments.
I wasn't really sold on the 3DS at the time however with the price drop the console suddenly looks very enticing and I have played some of the 3D games and I have to say there is a genuine enhancement benefit to the console enough to warrant a purchase up and above the old NDS.

Chris Kennedy wrote:

Hmm. I actually thought the DS had great 3rd party support! It is the Wii where I felt there was a lack of decent 3rd party titles.

You have a great example of a gimmick vs great innovation. The touch screen/dual screen aspect of the DS was something 3rd party developers got and latched onto. The Wii, on the other hand, felt like a gimmick and a tech demo.

DS did have great 3rd party support however the Wii has it's own following believe it or not the 3rd party games available for the Wii do sell.
I seen it with my own eyes at game a lady bought "bratsz" for her daughter because that's what she wanted.
So again I say with people making money which is the bottom line I don't see anyone changing their business plan any time soon.

Chris Kennedy wrote:

I do not consider Wii Sports shovelware. I consider it the best game on the system - It was solely responsible for turning the Wii into a "must have" device.

I'm trying to figure out which way you view the console I mean if you consider Wii Sports as the best game for the console then it would a sales perspective not gaming as there are seriously much better games than Wii Sports on the console.
In any case I didn't like Wii Sports too much it was a novel distraction at best but the meat of the console game when I got to play games like Twilight Princess and to be honest since the N64 that's what I wanted to buy Nintendo products for Nintendo games.
This is being another fair point as long as Nintendo has it's supporters willing to purchase their consoles and games then Nintendo will remain profitable.

Chris Kennedy wrote:

Sega made some BIG mistakes. I hope Nintendo doesn't make the same ones, but they need another hit if they stick with this game.

You say that the 3DS has fantastic 3rd party support. Are you aware of some games that have sold really well for the 3DS? Most everything I see promoted as a must have is a first party title. Same for the Wii U - Is there evidence that the Wii U is hot on the heels of the 3DS? Your statement ties into the "fantastic 3rd party support" of the 3DS, but I worry about the fate of the Wii U when someone says it is "hot on the heels of the 3DS."

Whatever Nintendo does - I wish them the best.

I have to say once more lets not base things on ifs and buts because any successful company will not make drastic changes such as going software only when they already have a successful business model.
You say if on Wii U and you don't like the 3ds fine but sales dictate above a single persons view.

From my point of view Nintendo did a lot of good this generation I think in one of the posts someone mentioned about Nintendo hardware not being good or mediocre etc.
However I have to disagree here Sony and Microsoft released hardware that was near enough same as the top graphics cards at the time with extremely power cpus to cope with the best that was available at the time and it came at a price the hardware is known to have problems with cooling.
However I have had no such problems with Nintendo products they have always been rock solid and reliable for me due to the tried and tested nature of the hardware.
Also the other point being on good games Nintendo have proven this generation that the best graphics and hardware isn't the must to create great games.
Nintendo DS was technically inferior to the PSP and we all know how that turned out.
The Wii technically inferior to the PS3 and Xbox and yet sold muchhhh better than two of the.

I guess it will come down to personal preference but while it did go dry for a bit there are some Gems to be found on the Wii and some great games to look forward to

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